Commons:Deletion requests/Files in Category:Uday Shankar

From Wikimedia Commons, the free media repository
Jump to navigation Jump to search
This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.

Files in Category:Uday Shankar

[edit]

The artist en:Uday Shankar died in 1977, the musicion en:Ravi Shankar in 2012. This is much too recent for a {{PD-old}} license.

JuTa 01:40, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  •  Keep. In terms of copyright law, these are recordings of traditional music, not music compositions. Uday Shankar was a dancer and choregrapher, not a composer. Ravi Shankar, aged 17 at the time of the recordings (1937), was merely an interpret. Pre 1972 sound recordings are not protected by copyright in the US. According to Indian law (which in my opinion should not apply here), the duration of copyright on sound recordings is 60 years. Please note these files are coming from Gallica, which not only assesses they are in the public domain, but has published on its blog an article on their exceptional educatonal value written by Audrey Viault, an archivist specialized in sound recordings (see here). It is very unlikely Bibliothèque nationale de France would draw the public's attention on these holdings without checking carefully its assessment of their copyright status. In any case, I have added {{PD-US-record}} to these files and replaced {{PD-old}} by {{PD-traditional}}. — Racconish ☎ 07:28, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Correction: the article on Gallica's blog is co-signed by Pascal Cordereix, who is the director of BNF's division of sound recordings [1] and wrote this article on BNF sound archives, which makes it even more unlikely the copyright assessment has not been carefully checked by BNF. — Racconish ☎ 10:12, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Comment The evidence seems contrary, but Racconish may have a point. Are there other recordings of this type and from this time in Gallica, or is this an exception? Regards, Yann (talk) 09:37, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    The same blog article by Audrey Viault on Gallica's web site mentions 2 other famous recordings assessed by BNF to be in the public domain, one of traditional Japanese music and one of traditional African music (some of which I have uploaded on Commons). Another case is the collection of Philippe Stern's recordings of traditional African music during the 1931 Colonial exhibition, assessed by BNF to be in the public domain, presented here and on BNF's paper periodic (Chroniques, n° 79, p. 30 [2]), some of which I have also uploaded on Commons. Closer to our case (but not as famous as the previous ones), there is also a PD recording from the 30s of traditional Indian music here and another undated PD recording of Indian music here. In 2009, Cordereix stated here BNF had about 1000 sound documents in the public domain, 40% of which was "world music". — Racconish ☎ 09:52, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
     Keep The source says these are in the public domain. Regards, Yann (talk) 10:06, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Delete I think the discussion above has ignored the fact that Ravi Shankar had a copyright in his performance. That is separate from the copyright for the recording, which lasts sixty years after creation. Such copyrights apparently last for fifty years after the performance if the performance was in India (1957 Act at Section 38). However, if the performance was outside India, which is likely according to Ravi Shankar, then it would probably last 70 years pma. I think that there is a significant doubt here. .     Jim . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 14:34, 28 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
     Comment Not sure what you mean. There is no composer copyright on traditional music and there are no claims of composition of these pieces by Ravi Shankar. If you mean the performer's right, it is not a statutory right in the USA, where the performance was recorded [3], for pre 1972 recordings. There is no such thing as a 70 years pma performer's right, even in Europe [4]. I suppose one could argue there could have been a 50 years performer's right derivated from the TRIPS agreement which would have been assigned to the US publisher of the record, but this right is not opposable any more. — Racconish ☎ 15:01, 28 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Kept: as per Racconish above. --Yann (talk) 19:29, 28 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Commons:Deletion_requests/Files_in_Category:Uday_Shankar&oldid=245846298"