Commons:Deletion requests/Images from Palio di Siena

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Images from Palio di Siena

Images/Symbols of Palio di Siena and its Contrade are trademarked [1] Cruccone 15:47, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fancy that. I am not well-versed in industrial property rights, so I cannot check if the Consorzio's claims hold actually any substance but in doubt, we'll probably have to Delete the whole lot. Jastrow (Λέγετε) 15:25, 3 April 2007 (UTC) On account of new evidence. Jastrow (Λέγετε) 21:58, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

keep - we don't care for trademark, but copyright only. --h-stt !? 19:33, 3 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep with {{Trademarked}} --Rtc 13:36, 4 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep with {{Trademarked}} -- 08:40, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
Keep --Historiograf 21:33, 5 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Keep could someone translate the "palio di Siena" entry here? It seems to me that the court of Milan decided in 1992 that the city of Siena was not entitled to a copyright on images of the Palio. Whether their trademark claim holds up is anyone's guess. Lupo 21:22, 18 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The ruling is dated 1992 and basically says that "Comune di Siena" does not hold copyright on the Palio symbols and that the Palio is old enough that participants cannot add enough originality to be relevant for copyright law. However, symbols of the contrade are trademarked, the application was filed on 22 April 2003 - well after the court ruling, take into account that in Italy a court ruling does not make a law as in the US or UK (applications are RM2003C002269 to RM2003C002287 in [2]) Cruccone 23:15, 18 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. So I did not misunderstand. When an Italian court decides that Siena has no copyright on the Palio, then Siena has no copyright on the Palio. (Unless the decision were overturned on appeal). Reminds me of that story about trying to copyright the whole Tuscany.[3][4] (No idea whether that is an urban myth or actually true.) As to the trademark issue:

RM2003C002269 is described as "un quadrato intorno al quale campeggia la seguente scritta in caratter e maiuscolo: sul lato sinistro "consorzio", sul lato alto "per la tute la del", sul lato destro "palio di siena". all'interno di detto quadra" (seems to be something missing. In any case, a square with the words "CONSORZIO" on the left, "PER LA TUTELA DEL" at the top, and "PALIO DI SIENA" at the right.)
RM2003C002287 is given as "un cerchio bordato, con elemento decorativo a forma di corda a segnarn e la circonferenza all'interno di detto cerchio e' rappresentato un tr iangolo equilatero i cui lati sono segnati da un bordo, le punte di de" (again, cut off). That's a triangle within a circle with a rope along the circumference.

I don't see those two trademarks anywhere on any of these images, on which neither the community of Siena nor the Consorzio per la Tutela del Palio di Siena have any copyrights. Lupo 10:32, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

WTF, if an Italian court states that Siena has no copyright on the Palio, that does not necessary imply that Siena has no copyright on the Palio, we follow Roman right, not Anglo-Saxon right, so each court ruling only applies to that specific case. Image:Plaque territory Aquila Siena.jpg is exactly RM2003C002270, Image:Siena-Chiocciola.JPG contains RM2003C002272 and so on. 69 to 87 means 69, 70, 71, 72, ..., 85, 86, 87 Cruccone 20:34, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Don't care, but am very flattered to be one of the authors of the controversial Palio pictures (Image:Siena Palio-Fahnen 20030815-360.jpg). Of course, if the people who contest my right to take and publish pictures taken in Siena during the Palio season (when you can see the flags of the different contrados (?) everywhere) should win this battle, photographers can go elsewhere (at the worst outside the whole of Tuscany) to take pictures. The property of pictures taken in public places is private only to the photographer. And the Roman versus Anglo-Saxon law controversy is ridiculous if not utter nonsense. Court decisions are not irrelevant as long as they haven't been reversed on appeal. Don't forget that even in Italy Berlusconi doesn't control everything. The world including Siena does not belong to trademarkers. (I'll trademark this statement immediately all over the world.) --wpopp 20:55, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, this is not my battle, I would be very happy if images can stay, I just want the situation to be clarified. And BTW, Berlusconi is no more Prime Minister, so you can take your anti-Italian statement elsewhere! Cruccone 11:51, 21 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If it's not your battle, whose is it. And I don't see anything anti-Italian in my statement. It's rather pro-Italian, since I said B. doesn't control everything. Ok? --wpopp 13:25, 21 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Just trying to clarify the situation. Occasionally people write to Italian OTRS with such claims. Cruccone 22:06, 23 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Keep I see no motivations to delete those pictures. ----ßøuñçê Y2K 13:02, 27 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Kept. MECU≈talk 17:52, 27 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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Commons:Deletion requests/Images from Palio di Siena

Images from Palio di Siena

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