User talk:Rowanwindwhistler/Archive 10

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And also:

Yours sincerely, Buidhe (talk) 18:42, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

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Yours sincerely, PlanespotterA320 (talk) 00:45, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

File:Nikolai Yezhov conferring with Stalin.jpg

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PlanespotterA320 (talk) 20:19, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

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Notification about possible deletion

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Yours sincerely, Magog the Ogre (talk) (contribs) 02:05, 5 September 2020 (UTC)

GMTED2010 use for topographic maps (help)

Hi, I'm an beginner in topographic maps and I love the vectorization you use for your maps like in the case of (File:Mapa topográfico de Rumanía.svg). I would kindly ask you how do you shade them and what program do you use (I try QGIS and editing on Inkscape) and I really want to style them as in your case of vectorized base maps. I had searched for an tutorial for GMTED2010 to make the shading and elevation and how to colorize the elevation because, I didn't find one, and I'm really interested how you do them and what you program do you use, and if you use other than the ones I said before. I consider they look by far the best on commons, they are really brilliant (in my opinion), and I really want to do the same style as yours but also give you credit on commons. I would really appreciate your response so it could help me to learn more about using GMTED2010 for topographic vectorization (I would prefer to use it in QGIS as base map).

Also if you have any tutorial you'd recommend I would be grateful!

Best regards, R1155

Hello. Thank you for your kind words but let me say upfront I am by no means an expert in topography or map making. I am basically self-taught, so I am probably making many mistakes... There are other users who I am sure know much more than I do. That said, if you are interested in using the method I use to create the vector shade layer in maps such as Mapa topográfico de Rumanía.svg I must warn you it is a bit clumsy and manual, not quick or elegant at all. But here it goes in case it is of any help (incidentally, I basically use QGIS and inkscape, though for the elevation layers I use gdal commands to make the process a bit more automatic, though QGIS can create them too):
1.-Upload the GMTED2010 or DEM of your choice into QGIS.
2.-Choose a nice projection your map, one using meters as unit as otherwise the shading calculation is not really correct.
3.-Reproject the DEM to use the projection used in step 2 (Raster/Projections/Warp (reproject))
4.-You should get a new layer with the chosen projection. Select it from the list of layers.
5.-Press F7 to bring up the layer style menu and choose the Hillshide option from the second drop-down menu. You should get a basic raster shade. Check the Z factor value a bit below. I read 1 is recommended but sometimes highier values (2, 3) render stronger shades that are better vectorized later on. (It may not be strictly correct but from my point of view the shade layer is just a way of giving a "3D feeling" to the map. The real information lies in the elevation lines.)
6.-Once you are all set with your map in QGIS, export it to SVG and make sure you keep the layers separate to make work easier in inkscape.
7.-Open your svg draft map in inkscape, hide all layers except the one with the raster shade.
8.-Here starts the trial and error part. Select the raster image and choose Path/trace Bitmap. You may try different combinations that may render a reasonably-looking shade. Here is one that usually works (not always!): Single scan, Brigghtness cutoff, Brightness threshold=0.750 (keep changing this parameter until you get all the detail you want, basically till all the main shades in the raster get in the final vector shade result), unset smooth corners, click preview to see if the main shades are being detected (if they are too few, make Brightness threshold highier, if it gets too dark (too many details) make it lower or set the invert the image button). Click ok and wait for the result.
9.-A black vector object will appear (the new vector shade). Cut it and paste into a new layer, separate from the original raster shade. Compare the two to ensure all the main details from the raster are there in the vector layer.
10.-Once you are satisfied with the level of detail, delete the raster shade, select the vector shade, make the stroke colour transparent (to make the shades thinner) and set the transparency/opacity to 12-15 % (or any other value that works for you: it should be visible but not hide the elevation information below). You will get a greyish shade layer . Put this layer on top of the elevation layers (you can check Mapa topográfico de Rumanía.svg to see where I usually place the hillshade layer).
That's the rather cumbersome process I use as I did not find a better one (though some people do have scripts that seem to make it more automatic). Incidentally, you may need to apply step 8 several times if the shade in the raster is made up of several pieces/objects.
When it comes to the elevation line styling, you can pick up the colours from here. I usually choose whatever colours make the elevation standout enough. If you follow my advice and keep the elevation lines from QGIS in separate layers in the exported SVG, filling the lines with the right colours in Inkscape is much faster (select all objects in a layer, set the fill colour, remove the stroke colour and carry on to the next elevation layer). As far as I can remember, you could make the colours more or less automatic in QGIS by turning the line elevation layers into polygons and defining some rules but I cannot really remember how it was done and I am not sure it saves too much time...
That's basically it (off the top of my head, so I may have forgotten some steps, but just let me know if anything looks confusing and I will try to clarify). Good luck the your map-making!--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 07:52, 11 September 2020 (UTC)


Hi again, thank you for advices, but I have encountered several errors while exporting to SVG (also tried PDF and didn’t work, also not opening on Inkscape) in New Print Layout on QGis (version 3.10), probably because of size and duplicate raster layers being one over the other. Also I have some questions:

1. Do you colour map with singleband pseudocolor with the convention colourmap palette (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Maps/Conventions/Topographic_maps) before exporting as SVG in Inkscape or do you change it only on Inkscape? (I also copied the hillshade layer above the coloured one and blended in overlay mode with -75 level of contrast, that’s in the Color Rendering from the Symbology menu of the layer).

2. Do you export the raster files directly to Inkscape and then use bitmap to vectorize or you convert them to vector in QGis (which didn’t worked for me because it didn’t do anything at all, just waiting a lot to polygonize which it seemed very useless).

3. Do you also vectorize the elevation (topo layers) on Inkscape or just the shading, as from what I understood that rastered elevation should be already in vector after exporting the map in SVG format, which didn’t worked for me.

4. Also where did you find the vector or raster ocean bottom layers used in both topographic maps of Romania and Yugoslavia that you made (which really look cool compared to the rastered ones I found on commons, in my opinion). I only could guess they are from NaturalEarth, but I doubt that. Also if you converted them from an rastered file to vector while exporting, I’m interested in that as well.

The only thing I did is that I coloured the GMTED2010 .tiff tile after the convention palette as you did in one of Mapa Topografico de la Austro-Hungria (that’s the combination I preferred for topographic elevation). https://drive.google.com/file/d/1X-bXPZ-w__r-10BuO5lBEb0cB1_8lZmv/view?usp=sharing - here you have the link of the coloured and hillshaded GMTED2010 files I did on QGis, and exported successfully in PNG only. If you recommend on how to export it on Inkscape with the version I use or how you do it on New Print Layout, as I said before I’m just an beginner and any advice would be really grateful ;-)

I also tried to export in SVG together with rivers and coastline from GSHHS (I consider them more accurate than from NaturalEarth), while using the filled coastline layer as base map (green flat elevation). For the projection I used is EPSG:102013 Europe_Albers_Equal_Conic which is the one I think you used for Mapa Topografico de Rumania.

Love your work and best regards, R1155

Let me see if I can try to answer the questions:
1.-I do practically all the colour settings in inkscape, both because I do not change the lines into polygons in QGIS (needed if you want to add the colours in QGIS, as otherwise you would only get coloured lines, not areas) and because I find it easier to do it there. Bear in mind the only raster layer I have in QGIS is the shade, all other layers (coasts, rivers, lakes, elevation lines, populated places, borders...) are vector layers by the time I export the map to SVG.
2.-I export the map from QGIS to SVG that I later on use in Inkscape. But the SVG I export from QGIS only has 1 non-vector (raster) layer: the shade layer. All others are vector layers. Most of the information is readily available in vector files (shp) already and can be added directly as vector layers in QGIS, such as Natural earth data (which I usually use for coast, sea, rivers, lakes...). The elevation lines, on the contrary, must be calculated from the GMTED2010 tiff file if you want vector data (or other DEM files, there are others with more precise data than GMTED2010 but remember the higher the detail, the bigger the resulting file and the required computer power to work with it). I use gdal commands to create shp files that I then add to the map as vector layers ("gdal_contour -a Cota -fl 1500.0 crop.tif A1500.shp -nln Cota_1500" to get the elevation line for 1500m over sea level, for instance, and similar commands for all the relevant heights), but QGIS can also make the calculations too (Raster/Extraction/Contour, if I am not mistaken).
3.-The only raster layer that remains by the time I export the QGIS file to SVG is the shade layer. All other layers are already vector layers. The only conversion to vector I do in inkscape is turning the raster shade layer into a new vector shade layer before getting rid of it too. The result from Inkscape is a fully vector map.
4.-When I include ocean layers I usually use the bathymetry layers from Natural Earth (you will find them already in vector format (shp) in the physical folder of the pack. You can see the available physical information here. Bathymetry is almost at the bottom). I simply add the layers I need in QGIS and then I apply the palette colours in Inkscape, using the same method used for above-sea-level layers. Incidentally, I think you could also generate bathymetry lines using negative height values on a raster that has below level "height" information (similar to the step I mentioned in 2 above, but with a different raster file that has below-sea-level data), but I have not used it as I am seldom interested in sea data. Using that raster (I can't remember where it is right now, but it must be available from here somewhere) you could also create shade layers for the sea as you can see in some maps, though I do not see much use in those...
As a first try, I would recommend trying to export to SVG a fully vector map (no raster, no tiff). Say you just add a few rivers and the ocean from natural earth. That should work. If it does (you may get some warnings when exporting, but it should be ok to disregard those), try creating the elevation vector layers using either the gdal commands above or QGIS and see if the export works too (still with a fully vector map). Then I would try creating the raster shade layer and exporting with that in place (remember the layer will look grey and ugly like this. Incidentally in that map you can see the result of the shade vectorization in inkscape: the black areas are the new vector shades while the grey background is the original raster shade layer before being removed from the map. That was a mistake of mine but useful as an example of the process). Also bear in mind files (SVG maps) tend to be rather big and difficult to handle (they can easily get up to 20-40M), so I would try first with a small map and not too many elevation lines to ensure your computer can cope with it.
I would also recommend, when exporting to SVG in QGIS to select the options to keep layers (or groups, I can't remember how QGIS calls them) and text as text (and not paths) as then you will get the QGIS layers as Inkscape layers and you will keep the text as editable, both useful later on when working with the map in Inkscape.
Have a go and see if things go better now using the above tips. Regards.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 07:45, 13 September 2020 (UTC)
I forgot something important: create the elevation lines (either using gdal commands or QGIS) BEFORE reprojecting the GMTED2010 tiff from degrees to meters to create the shade layer. If my memory serves my right, the process to get the height does not work if the projection uses meters... So leave the creation of the shade layer in QGIS till the last moment, when the rest of the map is already in place and almost ready for export.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 07:51, 13 September 2020 (UTC)
Hi, sorry if I might sound a bit slouch, but I'm still confused about how to vectorize the elevation from GMTED2010 files, so I might need some suggestions on that matter. I try to vectorize these tiles from the GMTED2010 Viewer, particularly those in max300 (max. 30 arc sec).tiff and I want to ask how do you vectorize them using GDAL commands, are you using the commands through the Python console on QGIS like in terminal (I use OSX) for elevation. I tried contour on QGIS but I didn't figure out how to vectorize them afterwards, so I removed the contour. Also if those files are too large for vectorization and how much would take to finish the elevation for an SVG map like the one you did as I said about above, as I try to reproduce it as a template for other maps in QGIS. Any tutorial you would recommend or any suggestion step by step with what commands should I type and where to make the elevation from raster tile (.tiff) to vector and also how you make the black flatness from raster tiles to become transparent (I read about an tutorial on topographic maps on commons said that the blackness from raster could become reduced so the flat green vector base would remain together with the elevation from the original monochrome tiles), as I still try to figure out through tutorials and docs about using GDAL on QGIS but they aren't really specifying on the elevation vector layers as you made in your maps. Thanks again for your explications on map-making, but as you said, if I don't finish with the elevation in vector layer I can't make the shades through reprojecting over them, as I started just from raster tiles, GSHHG and NaturalEarth vector data, while contouring and polygonizing on QGIS didn't helped me at all, probably I still don't have all the knowledge on how to use them properly.
If I had done any mistakes so far on how to vector or about other thing in this process, please let me know and correct me.
Thanks so far and best regards, R1155
Hmmm, I am not sure gdal is available under OSX to be used from a shell (I use linux and there is a package for gdal commands there). The command I mention (gdal_contour) works under the bash shell but I do not really know it works under OSX, you would need to check it. I use those commands from the shell, I just add the resulting shp file in QGIS afterwards (i.e. I do not use the commands within QGIS).
If gdal is not available under OSX for use "manually" (from some OSX shell), you can let QGIS create the elevation lines. Try this procedure and see if it works for you (you can see an example here):
1.-Upload your DEM tiff (GMTED2010 or other) into QGIS.
2.-Go to Raster/Extraction/Contour. Set "Input layer" to the layer where the tiff is (this is the DEM file that will be "sliced" into elevation layers). Set "Interval between contour lines" to 500 (500m over sea level, just to get a first elevation vector line). Set "Contours" to the file name where the new elevation data will be stored (a main shp file and its usual companion files, stored for later use if necessary.I would recommend something meaningful like "Elevation500"). Ensure the radio button below (upload resulting file...) is set. Click OK, wait for the process to finish and verify a new vector layer shows up in the layer list and a new elevation contour lines show up in the map (for 500m over sea level in this case).
3.-Repeat the process just changing "Interval between contour lines" to the desired height values (I usually create layers for 500m 1000m, 1500m... 500m apart, but it depends on the area you are mapping, of course, and the level of detail you want. Bear in mind the larger the number of layers, the bigger the resulting SVG map!). Each time you run the process, you should get a new elevation layer on the map, with a random line colour. Repeat the creation of elevation lines till you get all the ones you want.
4.-Unless you turn these lines into polygons in QGIS (I would not recommend it), you can not assign them fill colours as they are lines, not areas. That's why I recommend leaving that for Inkscape (where those lines will become areas automatically and will be able to be filled with the desired colour from the topography palette).
5.-Now that the elevation layers are in place, you can add the rest of the vector layers (rives, coast...), change the main projection of the QGIS project to the desired one and then reproject the tiff layer to that same projection using Raster/Projections/Warp (reproject). Then you can create the hillshade layer using the reprojected tiff layer that will be created, get rid of the original one and get ready to export to SVG. You can see how to create the (raster) shade layer here (just the first 3 minutes, the rest is to create a raster map, not a vector one).
The files you mention should be ok for vectorization provided your computer is powerful enough (mine is not for the highest definition option, 7.5º, for instance). The creation of the elevation vector lines/files would take from seconds to a few minutes (lower heights contain more points and take longer to create. And there resulting shp files are bigger).
One thing I am not sure whether I mentioned or not is that the way I create the maps, the SVG that comes out of QGIS will look VERY ugly (a grey raster layer hiding all other data or just covered with random colours). For the map to look like the final map, quite some tweaking is needed in Inkscape. But the good side of it is that, if your computer is powerful enough, that can be done rather quickly once you get the hang of it.
Let me know if the above method works for you.--Rowanwindwhistler (talk) 08:35, 14 September 2020 (UTC)
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