Commons:Requests for comment/Costumed character files

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User:Abzeronow closed the Commons:Deletion requests/Files uploaded by Sahaib without there being a wider discussion on the files in Category:Characters at Disney Experiences, which I requested twice. I have already told them on their talk page that I am considering an undeletion request because another problem I see with this is that each image was different so there should have been more nuanced discussion about what exactly COM:COSTUME means. As I say if users agree that the images (or at least most of them) should be deleted, then similar images should also be deleted for consistency. Sahaib (talk) 07:25, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Posted on COM:VPC for transparency and potentially expand reach of this RfC. I followed what I understood of COM:Costume in the DR since these are Disney employees in costume, and most of them were the animal characters with masks that would be considered copyrighted under COM:Costume. Abzeronow (talk) 17:51, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It may be helpful to draw a line between stage clothing (like Cinderella or Mary Poppins) and mascot costumes (like Mickey / Minnie Mouse and Donald Duck). The latter are more akin to wearable sculptures than articles of clothing, and seem much more likely to be copyrightable. Omphalographer (talk) 21:50, 14 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Omphalographer: Some of the images I uploaded weren't nominated such as in the categories Category:Ariel at Tokyo DisneySea, Category:Chip 'n' Dale at Tokyo DisneySea, Category:Donald Duck at Tokyo DisneySea, Category:Edna Mode at Tokyo DisneySea, Category:Elastigirl at Tokyo DisneySea, Category:Fifer Pig at Tokyo Disneyland, Category:José Carioca at Tokyo DisneySea (two of the images aren't mine), Category:Mr. Incredible at Tokyo Disneyland. Sahaib (talk) 04:14, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
These involve character copyrights. For previous discussions, see Commons:Deletion requests/Image:Donaldduck-thespiritof43-2.jpg, Commons:Deletion requests/File:Superman-fleischer.jpg, Commons:Deletion requests/Files in Category:Fleischer and Famous Studios Superman images, Category talk:PD Cartoon - Superman#character copyright, Commons talk:Derivative works#Character copyright status, and Commons:Deletion requests/File:"Appreciate America. Come On Gang. All Out for Uncle Sam" (Mickey Mouse)" - NARA - 513869.tif#File:"Appreciate_America._Come_On_Gang._All_Out_for_Uncle_Sam"_(Mickey_Mouse)"_-_NARA_-_513869.tif_3.   — 🇺🇦Jeff G. ツ please ping or talk to me🇺🇦 16:02, 15 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Oppose deletion of such images. IMO, the {{Costume}} disclaimer is sufficient for the overwhelming majority of such cosplay images - licences apply to the photograph, not to the character itself which may be cosplayed in the photograph. I wonder if there ever have been any cases of copyright holders of cosplayed characters complaining about free licence cosplay images. ~TheImaCow (talk) 21:50, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion of which images? All of them? The whole point of this RfC is to have a discussion about the nuances that were glossed over in the original discussion, not to just gloss over them again. Nosferattus (talk) 21:58, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cosplay images. Which I define as images of random people dressing up as random characters. ~TheImaCow (talk) 16:36, 7 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

According to the U.S. Copyright Office, masks that are "pictorial and/or sculptural" are always copyrightable. So images that depict such masks should be deleted. The situation with clothing as costume is more complicated. Nosferattus (talk) 22:01, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for finding that policy decision. With this in mind, it seems a fairly clear conclusion that the mascot costumes depicted in images like File:Disneyland Paris Halloween Parade 12.jpg are indeed copyrightable works - particularly as they would be "independently recognizable and capable of existence" (p. 3) as freestanding sculptures. (Indeed, I'm not certain whether the Donald Duck in that photo is a costume or not.) Omphalographer (talk) 23:53, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Delete per nom and Omphalographer.   — 🇺🇦Jeff G. ツ please ping or talk to me🇺🇦 00:05, 7 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"The situation with clothing as costume is more complicated." - Yes, thats the topic of that discussion. ~TheImaCow (talk) 16:37, 7 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Agree with Nosferattus, and thank you for the link to the "pictoral and/or sculptural" rule. I was never sure how to phrase that, when deleting mascot costumes, but this seems like an excellent delineation, between those like Mickey Mouse and, say, the typical Snow White costume. Bastique ☎ let's talk! 18:21, 29 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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