Commons:Deletion requests/File:Kashgar Xi Jinping billboard.jpg

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This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.

File:Kashgar Xi Jinping billboard.jpg

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Billboards are non-permanent displaywithout the attribution from the author(s), cannot benefit from FOP A1Cafel (talk) 16:48, 18 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

 Keep China's copyright law explicitly allows 对设置或者陈列在公共场所的艺术作品进行临摹、绘画、摄影、录像, which COM:FOP China translates to copying, drawing, photographing, or video recording of an artistic work located or on display in a public place (Article 24, Clause 10). There is no requirement for such an artistic work to be permanently located in a public place or be permanently on display in a public place; the only requirement appears to be that the artistic work be located in or on display in a public place at the time of the creation of the copy, drawing, photograph, or video recording. As such, the fact that billboards are non-permanent display is wholly irrelevant to the FOP analysis in China, and this should be kept. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 18:06, 18 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
 Comment COM:FOP stated that The exception generally applies only to works on permanent public display.--A1Cafel (talk) 00:41, 19 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Chinese law would obviously trump whatever the general case in other countries might be, if it contradicts with that. It looks like Red-tailed knows Chinese copyright law and you don't. -- Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:50, 19 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
In Commons:Deletion requests/File:Converse poster - panoramio.jpg, another user came to the same conclusion: permanence is not required by Chinese FoP. Brianjd (talk) 11:39, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep per above. Brianjd (talk) 11:40, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the link. User:JWilz12345 reminded me that Chinese FOP: a work may be exploited without the permission from, and without payment of remuneration to, the copyright owner, provided that the name or designation of the author and the title of the work are mentioned and the normal use of the work, or unreasonably damage the lawful rights and interests of the copyright owner shall not be affected. The billboards is still lack of the attribution of the author(s). --A1Cafel (talk) 15:47, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@A1Cafel: I put my faith in the other users and forgot to check the other conditions. Yes, attribution is required. The file description does say: Author: Photo: Kubilayaxun; Billboard: more likely the government of the People's Republic of China. Is it possible to give any further attribution? Brianjd (talk) 15:52, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The relevant part (in Chinese) reads 但应当指明作者姓名或者名称、作品名称. While I will gladly defer to a native speaker of Mandarin Chinese, I think that this means that we only need the title of the work or the name of the author. And the author here is the Government of the People's Republic of China. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 21:45, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
、（頓號） implies an "and" clause. The sentence in English should be "However, the name or name of the author, and the title of the work should be specified"--A1Cafel (talk) 06:55, 23 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"、" (顿号) is an enumeration comma, used to separate items in a list. A1Cafel's interpretation may be likely correct. Per COM:FOP China, there exists a recent case, in which a district court in Chongqing (in 2016) ruled that postcards showing a full-body outdoor sculpture as copyright infringement. ([1] and [2]) The postcards had no attribution to the sculptor. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 15:17, 24 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
 Delete, permanent display is required. See this reply by Supreme People's Court in 1995:

该作品是专门为参加灯会创作的，灯会结束后，该作品即被运回存放，不另在公共场所设置或陈列，因而不应将其认定为“设置或者陈列在公共场所的艺术作品”。
This work is specially created for participation in the Lantern Festival. After the end of the Lantern Festival, this work will be transported back for storage and will not be set up or displayed in public places. Therefore, it should not be recognized as "an artistic work set up or displayed in public places".

Teetrition (talk) 14:50, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Teetrition If that’s true, then COM:FOP China should be updated. Brianjd (talk) 23:37, 19 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Brianjd: Text updated.
If anyone has different opinions on this reply by Supreme People's Court, feel free to undo my revision and explain your reason. Teetrition (talk) 04:06, 20 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@JWilz12345 and Teetrition: I will leave it to others who know more about this subject to comment further. Someone (not necessarily you) also needs to go through the cases that have been kept and check if they need to be deleted; I have seen at least one recent case kept on the basis that Chinese FOP does not require permanence. Brianjd (talk) 06:29, 20 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, the recent case I mentioned was the one being discussed here; it’s being going on so long I thought it had been kept.
Anyway, it looks like there are some other cases that need to be checked:
Brianjd (talk) 06:53, 20 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@A1Cafel  Keep You do not know the laws of freedom of panorama and it is not the first time, first it was with the laws of Mexico and then with the laws of China. Aurelio de Sandoval (Mensajes aquí please) 04:03, 4 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@A1Cafel And as user Ikan Kekek told you: "Red-tailed knows Chinese copyright law and you don't". Aurelio de Sandoval (Mensajes aquí please) 04:06, 4 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Aurelio de Sandoval not anymore. Chinese FOP does not cover temporary works. The FOP clause in the law is just generalized clause that makes FOP existing in China, but courts there specified the parameters of Chinese FOP. Among other parameters, temporal works in public (like temporary lanterns exhibited publicly as per a court statement) does not count as artistic works "set up or displayed in public places." Thus all Commons photos of Chinese billboard artworks by living or recently deceased artists must be submitted for removals. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 08:54, 15 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Deleted: per nomination. Apart from the discussion of permanent display, there should be given attribution per COM:FOP China. No author of the display is listed in the File description, and therefore the file must be deleted imho. --Ellywa (talk) 22:35, 31 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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