Commons:Deletion requests/File:Sandsculpting, Frankston, Vic jjron, 21.01.2009.jpg

From Wikimedia Commons, the free media repository
Jump to navigation Jump to search
This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.

File:Sandsculpting,_Frankston,_Vic_jjron,_21.01.2009.jpg

[edit]

According to the Australian Copyright Act of 1968, freedom of panomama only applies to sculptures permanently situated in a public place. Unless this sand sculpture is permanent, it doesn't meet the requirement, unfortunately. Kaldari (talk) 17:29, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Is this possibly a "free if it is, free if it ain't" kind of thing (to rework a cliche)? As in, if this was permanent it would be free under panoramafreiheit, but because it is a non-permanent sand sculpture can the original artist claim copyright? Staxringold (talk) 18:47, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • As the work wasn't a permanent public installation, the sculpture artist is entitled to claim copyright over any reproductions or derivatives of the work, including photography. I don't believe there are any laws saying that a work has to still exist in order to claim copyright over the derivatives. Kaldari (talk) 19:16, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Here is an interesting nuance from the Commons page: "Whether a work is installed at a public place permanently or not is not a question of absolute time, but a question of what the intention was when the work was placed there. If it was put there with the intention of leaving it in the public place indefinitely or at least for the whole natural lifetime of the work, then it is "permanent"." May seem to cover it? --jjron (talk) 08:46, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

And for the record, as I stated at the enwiki FPC nom en:Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/File:Sandsculpting, Frankston, Vic jjron, 21.01.2009.jpg: "I don't know a lot about legalities, but for what it's worth they certainly stated no restrictions on photography or use of said photos in any way at the festival (and I did look to see)." Furthermore the people saw me setting up my camera and watched me taking dozens of photos there with absolutely no problem. Not that that may mean much either way. --jjron (talk) 08:56, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • The second part of that sentence certainly seems to cover it. The statue was clearly left in public as the artist expected it to stay there for it's natural life. Staxringold (talk) 12:24, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Well my reading of it is the same, its a permanent piece, it just doesnt last 100's of years. I think temporary would dictate whether or not the artist himself removed the sculpture after a set period of time. jjron, do you know if the works were left to crumble or were taken down? --Childzy (talk) 13:21, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • I believe they 'treat' these things in some way so that they last for a few months otherwise they'd just fall apart in the first rainfall, I don't know much about it really. At the end of the festival presumably they haven't all collapsed, but they would just bulldoze what was left. Either way though, I would interpret it that its 'whole natural lifetime' has been spent in this one place. Having thought about this overnight, I suspect the law is probably trying to cover instances where say a copyrighted work is carried through a public place and someone photographs it then claims 'freedom of panorama' because it was publicly accessible. In this case it wouldn't be permanent as it was only being moved through the location. --jjron (talk) 07:50, 12 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep As permanent as ice sculptures. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 19:14, 12 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep No structure is permanent. A sandstone sculpture will also erode (albeit after 1,000s of years), so I don't see the point. The sculpture is permanent until it erodes. OSX (talk • contributions) 05:54, 15 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep It was permanently situated there; it was not intended (nor would it have been feasible) to remove it and display it or store it at another location. --Jayen466 17:30, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep Encouragement or permission of photography sets a presumption of open access. Therefore we should not jump the gun by censoring such a beautiful photograph. Macdonald-Ross (talk) 15:42, 23 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
 Keep For all comments above. Jacopo Werther (talk) 17:46, 2 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Withdraw deletion request. Per snowball. Kaldari (talk) 17:22, 26 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Kept (non-admin closure). /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 20:32, 10 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Sandsculpting,_Frankston,_Vic_jjron,_21.01.2009.jpg&oldid=31729562"