Commons:Deletion requests/File:Bulletin of the Natural Histort Museum. Geology series (1996) (20485927112).jpg

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This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.

File:Bulletin of the Natural Histort Museum. Geology series (1996) (20485927112).jpg

[edit]

Another case of what may be good-faith Flickr washing. This paper is from 1997, the artist is John Sibbick, and the journal is not otherwise free. Everything on Flickr may not be kosher, and perhaps should not be mass-uploaded. FunkMonk (talk) 18:46, 1 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The digitization was by the Natural History Museum Library and the copyright of the bulletin is held by The Natural History Museum as stated at the start of each copy. The NHM Library donated the digital copies to the BHL, and in turn these were released via the Internet Archive and then the IA book images Flickrstream. I have just tried to work out who might be a good person to contact to check if the intention was for the NHM to support the release of copies of the Bulletin in this way on Flickr Commons, but the NHM website points me to a rather generic form.
@Edwbaker: any thoughts on the NHM's position on Commons holding images from the bulletin as "no copyright known", or who we ought to write to (email me if you would prefer)? As part of my IA book plates project, I have uploaded many images that might need to be deleted if this DR results in a deletion, see search. --Fæ (talk) 22:55, 1 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Fæ: I have just emailed you some people to contact. --Edwbaker (talk) 11:43, 5 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Excellent, I'll get on to it and post an update here for any replies. --Fæ (talk) 08:17, 9 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Fæ: Any news? --Hedwig in Washington (mail?) 23:08, 21 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I have to chase this around (I'm surprised looking at the dates, thanks for the ping). 'Real life' stuff got in the way. I'll try to get on it tomorrow. Note that this affects many files, so even if we delete this one, the discussion and eventually decision of what to do needs to be on record. --Fæ (talk) 23:16, 21 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Fæ: No problem. Don't close until 11-7-2015 or Fæ left a note. <-Delete when responded. :-) --Hedwig in Washington (mail?) 05:32, 22 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Request now with the NHM Intellectual Property Rights Officer. Hopefully we'll get an official statement one way or the other. Thanks --Fæ (talk) 11:57, 24 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2015 12:54:24 +0100

Subject: NHM digitization and releases of "Bulletin of the Natural History Museum"
To: <***@nhm.ac.uk>

Dear ***,

[...] I hope you can clarify the intended copyright of older editions of the "Bulletin of the Natural History Museum". I am an volunteer with Wikimedia Commons, having worked with the NHM as a volunteer in the past, and as part of one of our open knowledge projects have released several hundred images from the Bulletin. An example image file with associated links, copyright statement and a deletion discussion can be found in the Links section below.

The way these images came to be on Wikimedia Commons and originally released by the NHM was in following stages:

  1. The bulletin was scanned and released by the NHM in partnership with the Biodiversity Heritage Library.
  2. Released by the BHL to the Internet Archive website.
  3. Relevant automatically generated crops of images posted to Flickr Commons, on the Internet Archive official stream under 'No Known Copyright', the default license for that type of release.
  4. Batch uploaded to Wikimedia Commons from Flickr, with the license confirmed by automated verification.

I believe it was the intention of the NHM to share copies of the Bulletin as widely as possible with the public, and having images and diagrams from the Bulletin on Wikimedia Commons has the distinct benefit that they can be easily included in Wikipedia articles with associated public impact.

Could you clarify whether these images can be considered public domain, or on a free license compatible with Wikimedia Commons such as CC-BY-SA? Unfortunately if the Bulletin should be on a non-commercial or no derivatives restriction than they will have to be deleted from Wikimedia Commons.

If rather than a literal IP question, this is more an issue of NHM policy, perhaps you could suggest an alternative contact for me to approach?

Thanks in advance,
[Fae]

Links:

  1. Example Wikimedia Commons file: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bulletin_of_the_Natural_Histort_Museum._Geology_series_%281996%29_%2820485927112%29.jpg
  2. Internet Archive catalogue page: https://archive.org/details/bulletinofnatura52natu
  3. BHL catalogue page: http://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/bibliography/53542 (copyright "not specified")
  4. Commons deletion discussion: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Bulletin_of_the_Natural_Histort_Museum._Geology_series_%281996%29_%2820485927112%29.jpg
  • Note that even if the volume turns out to be free, that particular painting most likely isn't. See the attribution in the thanks section:[1] "We also thank John Sibbick for generously permitting the reproduction of his painting of Baryonyx (Frontispiece).". This does not seem like the rights of the painting are in any way tied to the article. FunkMonk (talk) 10:28, 30 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I agree, I think we'll have to delete this illustration. John Sibbick is a freelance illustrator. He is selling copies of this illustration on his web site at Baryonyx walkeri, with Brachiosaurid and Polacanthus. His site claims "website and all images © John Sibbick 2002-2006. all rights reserved". —RP88 (talk) 11:43, 7 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Deleted: Per the last two comments. Even if the NHM comes back with permission, it seems unlikely that their license from the artist would go farther than the NHM publication. I doubt very much that the artist intended that his painting be freely licensed. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 20:30, 9 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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