This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.
The stamps on this postal cover (I think that's what it is) look to be based on images that are PD due to age. However, the artwork on the side of the cover (or whatever) is probably copyrighted until at least 2,053. That is unless someone can find evidence of it being a reproduction of an image that is in the public domain. I looked around for it myself in a couple of places but wasn't to able to find a prior example. Although I don't speak Greek either. So maybe someone who does can find it. Adamant1 (talk) 13:25, 28 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator Adamant1 has acknowledged he is "not an expert on ships by any means...". This ship is obviously of a pre-WW1 design.
Adamant1 has acknowledged he is not knowledgeable on nautical matters From what I remember I said I wasn't an "expert" on nautical matters. Not that I don't have any knowledge of the topic. I'm sure you get the difference. I know you can't seem to resist misconstruing what I say and my position every time you have an opportunity to though. Anyway, how many times now have I asked to stop with the personal comments? Honestly, it's kind of weird that you spend so much time being critical of me and how I do things but yet you can't seem to do a simple thing like write a message without taking a jab at me by making false personal comments about how much knowledge I supposedly have about something or whatever the strawman of the moment happens to be. --Adamant1 (talk) 15:49, 1 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Comment As to what Geo Swan has said that is actually on topic, it's pretty easy to by comparing the file I nominated for deletion and the one he claims it's based on that they are different images. For instance the ship in File:70 year old post stamp of Lesvos.jpg has a flag on the front. Whereas, the one in File:"Averof" in dark gray paint, c.1913.jpg clearly doesn't. The angle of the bow is different in both images to. Unfortunately it seems that Geo Swan was to busying worrying about how much knowledge of "nautical matters" I have to see if the ships in the images actually matched. Regardless, they clearly aren't the same ship. Let alone are they the same images. --Adamant1 (talk) 16:14, 1 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You have acknowledged you aren't an expert on ships. So, let me say this in the nicest way I can, your assertion that "the angle of bow" in the two images is different, is incorrect. There is a bow wave in the photograph. It rides up the bow, making it a different shade of grey. When you take that into account the bows are, in fact, identical.
To the right there is a very blurry image... I cropped the flag from the line drawing. My crop was 18x14 pixels. I suggest it was added on, for dramatic effect, but at 18x14, it is de minimis. File:70 year old post stamp of Lesvos (flag crop).jpg
Your assertion that they "clearly aren't the same ship". Let me say this in the nicest way I can, the size and shapes, of the two masts and three smokestacks, and their relative positions to one another, is very very highly distinctive. In the nicest way I can possibly say this, your assertion is incorrect. Sorry. Geo Swan (talk) 20:19, 2 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You have acknowledged you aren't an expert on shipsCough cough. Anyway, the bow on the ship in the image on the postal cover clearly slants backwards toward the ship. Whereas, the bow of the ship in the second image is curved in a half circle and points away from the ship at the top as can clearly be seen in in this image. As to your comment about smoke stakes, it's pretty routine for navy ships (as well as other kinds of ships BTW) to have three smoke stakes and for them to be round. So I'm not really sure what exactly that proves. Except ships have round smoke stakes sometimes. It's not that crazy that you could have found an image of a ship with smoke stakes that are round either.
That said, even if I buy that they are the same ship, which I don't, that doesn't automatically mean the images are the same. One piece of evidence that they aren't is the waves in the first image that aren't in the second. Including the curved waved on the bottom left that clearly isn't in the second image. Also the waves in the first image are mostly parallel lines, but the waves in the second one are extremely choppy and not at all parallel to each other. So even if the images were of the same ship, they aren't the same picture. That said, I'm sure the closing administrator will be able to compare the images and make their own decision based on the evidence. So I'd appreciate it if we ended it there. it's not really worth discussing beyond what we have already anyway. --Adamant1 (talk) 21:24, 2 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Deleted: per nomination; to answer Geo Swan's questions, "faithful reproductions" do not generate a new copyright, but these are not -- they appear to be engravings based on photos or drawings, which makes them derivative works. —holly {chat}21:43, 16 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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Comment As to what Geo Swan has said that is actually on topic, it's pretty easy to by comparing the file I nominated for deletion and the one he claims it's based on that they are different images. For instance the ship in File:70 year old post stamp of Lesvos.jpg has a flag on the front. Whereas, the one in File:"Averof" in dark gray paint, c.1913.jpg clearly doesn't. The angle of the bow is different in both images to. Unfortunately it seems that Geo Swan was to busying worrying about how much knowledge of "nautical matters" I have to see if the ships in the images actually matched. Regardless, they clearly aren't the same ship. Let alone are they the same images. --Adamant1 (talk) 16:14, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
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Keep the rest. -- Robert Weemeyer (talk) 08:36, 10 August 2023 (UTC)
